<p>Forty four million Americans are impacted by mental health conditions in any given year. Depression is the #1 cause of disability in the U.S. <br /><br />Eve Sweeting is taking mental health in workplace head on and has tips for HR professionals and people managers alike in this episode. Straight from Eve: "Silence undermines workplace productivity, its harming our business cultures and its costing us billions of dollars each year."<br /><br />Listen in as Callie and Eve talk about what orgs, leadership, managers and employees can do to take on this important issue.</p>
Forty four million Americans are impacted by mental health conditions in any given year. Depression is the #1 cause of disability in the U.S.
Eve Sweeting is taking mental health in workplace head on and has tips for HR professionals and people managers alike in this episode. Straight from Eve: "Silence undermines workplace productivity, its harming our business cultures and its costing us billions of dollars each year."
Listen in as Callie and Eve talk about what orgs, leadership, managers and employees can do to take on this important issue.
Callie Zipple:
Hello, everybody, and welcome back to Honest HR. I'm your host, Callie Zipple, Field Service Director with SHRM. Excited to be here again, for a new episode. I have a new guest, which we'll get to in a moment. Want to thank everybody who has been with us before. And for those that are new, thanks for making us a part of your HR journey. We're excited you're here and if you're not aware, we do change guests and topics every week. So if you aren't interested in what we're talking about today, go back, listen to some of the previous episodes or come back for a future episode. Like I said, we change topics and guests as often as possible. Today, our topic is mental health in the workplace.
And this is a different topic than the ones we've covered in the past and I'm excited to have this conversation, because it's certainly an important one, specifically to HR professionals, but employees and people really in general. I'm excited to have my guest here today, Eve. We go way back actually. We served on the YPAC together, supporting national SHRM a few years ago. We met then. She had listened to a couple episodes, reached out, thought this topic was important, and is excited, I hope, to be with us. So Eve, tell us a little bit about your background, why the topic is important to you. And then, we'll jump into the questions that we've talked about.
Eve:
Yes, thank you, Callie. I'm very excited about this. My name is Eve. I've worked in human resources, I like to say, for a little over a decade, because then, you don't really know how old I am. I still think I'm a young professional, even though I've probably aged out of that group. I'm currently working in the public sector. But what really got me involved in this topic, I'm the Diversity Director for HR Florida. So when we were talking about things that we want to focus on, as far as diversity, we decided to focus on non-traditional areas, so not race, not gender, ethnicity, things like that. But how can we really expand diversity and educate HR professionals and employers about everything that makes us diverse? And so we hit upon disabilities, and in particularly, mental health, because it's not something that we talk about a lot in the workplace. It's just become a passion of mine to be able to talk about this and the number of people that it impacts, either directly or indirectly, and be able to spread that with other HR professionals.
Callie Zipple:
I think it's great and I think the work that you and HR Florida is doing has been recognized. You're a Pinnacle winner, is that right?
Eve:
Yes. We have won the Pinnacle Award, which we're very proud of, not only for our work in the mental health arena, but also focus on autism in the workplace too.
Callie Zipple:
Wonderful. Well, congratulations on your Pinnacle Award. We can talk a little bit more about what that means later. And for those who maybe aren't SHRM volunteers, that's probably not something you understand, but it's a big deal. So we're excited for Eve and HR Florida. So with that, again, thank you for suggesting the topic. Like I said before, I think it's important. It affects those with mental health, but it also affects those who are dealing with the individuals that have the mental health. So it spans many more people than I think people realize. So my first question and the first thing we talked about is, why do you think it's important for HR, in really any organization, to be aware of how widespread really this issue is?
Eve:
Sure. Well, according to the National Alliance on Mental Illness, one in five Americans will experience the mental health illness every year. So that's 44 million Americans. And as you mentioned, it's not just the individuals that directly have the mental illness, but those who may be caregivers for children or other family members that are impacted by this. So it's very important as HR professionals that we realize these are employees. These are the people who are coming to work every day and they may have these things going on that we don't recognize and they're afraid to come forward because they're afraid that they may lose their job, that they may not get the promotion. They may not get that assignment. So it's important for us to realize that. Depression it's become so widespread in our country.
It's the number one cause of disability around the world, to be perfectly honest. And it costs our businesses a huge amount of money in absenteeism and presenteeism. Individuals need to take time off. They need to cope with what's going on with their medications or their therapies, but they're afraid to come forward to HR to say that because there is so much stigma around it. We tend to treat mental illness as a weakness, as a moral failing, whereas if somebody had diabetes or high blood pressure, you don't treat it the same way. And so we are trying to change that perception.
Callie Zipple:
And I think that's the most important thing about this is that people need to be comfortable having these conversations, but with that, people need to be comfortable hearing when people come forward with these sorts of issues and conversations in the workplace. And I think that's a great segue to this next question that we talked about. And it's most of the time, the manager of the employee is going to be the person hearing about these issues at first. Eventually, we hope it bubbles up to HR because that's where most things like this should live, but the manager really needs to do the frontline support and supervision of these employees. So how important do you think it is for managers to go through maybe what we would call "awareness training" to make sure that they know how to recognize when employees that report to them are going through this or have somebody that's in their life, that's going through it and that's maybe affecting the way that they're doing their job?
Eve:
It's critical because as you said, the managers on the frontline of this and they could just think that an employee's having a performance issue having a bad day, suck it up and move on, when really, they have something going on that they can't just suck it up and move on. So there is training out there that managers can go through. Palm beach county, just to throw them out there, had a wonderful, they had four sessions of Mental Health First Aid Training recently sold out sessions for HR professionals and managers who wanted to come learn more about what are the warning signs. And then if someone does present with these warning signs, how can you help them? What some of the language that you can use to talk to someone who may be going through a mental health crisis? The language that we use is often very stigmatizing. We'll say, "Oh, she's acting crazy today", or, "Oh, they're so OCD", or something else along the lines.
And that's just even more stigmatizing to someone who may be actually dealing with a mental health condition. So to make managers and other employees, even aware of the language around mental health is very important. And then to train managers when you see these warning signs, when you see someone who may be having productivity issues, or maybe giving you hints that there's something going on in their life, to offer support, to open the door to that conversation, to talk about, do you need a referral? EAP is a huge resource that most of us have, but varied few employees actually take advantage of. So to bring some of these training forth that managers can understand what to look for and then to, yes, refer them to HR, if they need further assistance that employee dealing with whatever they may be going through.
Callie Zipple:
And I think too, for managers specifically, we need to equip them with language when they are uncomfortable in those conversations. So we need to make sure that our managers understand that they can say, "I appreciate this and I hear you. I would like to have somebody else be involved in this conversation because I want to make sure that we're getting you all the help that we can", instead of trying as a manager to get through that conversation on their own. So I think not only do we have to equip them with how to manage those conversations, but also recognizing themselves when they're not ready to or equipped to have those conversations with those individuals as well.
Eve:
Absolutely. We had an example where I work, actually, we had a manager call us up and say, "I know this employee has been going through some rough things recently. I saw Facebook that they've had a recent death in the family. He's just not acting himself at work. What can I do?" And so I kudos that manager. Absolutely, for reaching out. And we said, "Do you want us to try to talk to the employee? Do you want to talk to the employee? Whatever you feel is most comfortable." And as the manager, we gave him some talking points, gave him some resources, but he felt because he had that direct bond with the employee, that he would be the best person to reach out. And so the employee went and sought counseling because of that. Whereas if that outreach hadn't been made, who knows what would've happened. So many people sit with depression or anxiety and don't get it addressed. And so it just continues. But because of that outreach, he was able to go get treatment.
Callie Zipple:
So let me ask you another question, which we didn't talk about prior to this recording. So I'm throwing it at you out of left field, but as somebody who has in the past, struggled with depression, it's not always something that we want to talk about. And I'm talking from experience here now. So how can we as HR professionals be okay with not talking to people who have these issues? And what I mean by that is if we know somebody's going through something and we want to reach out to that individual, but they are just not hearing us and not wanting to insert that into their professional lives. How can we work through something like that?
Eve:
I think the most important part is try to meet the employee where they are, because at the end of the day, we're all people and you may not want to discuss that at work. You may not want your coworkers to know that you're going through this because it's a personal thing. You don't want to bring it into the workplace. But I think having the conversation and maybe saying to them, do you need some time off, do you need some accommodations as you're going through this? What can this organization do to help you? I think is the most important part because they may take you up on it and they may not, but at least you've made that outreach, you've made that offer and you're acknowledging that they're going through something, whether or not they want to talk about it. You can just say, "We're here. We have an open door if you need to come back and talk about it a later date, we're happy to do that too."
Callie Zipple:
And I think navigating that, "no", is sometimes what's difficult for managers and HR professionals because they've done all this preparation and they have all of the resources that they're really excited can help these individuals. But there's just some people that are going to say, "No. I'm not interested, I'm working through it on my own. And I want you to respect that and understanding how that "no" continues to affect their work is what we need to know how to do as managers and HR professionals.
Eve:
And it can be difficult because you recognize that may be impacting them on the job. So how do you try to navigate that line between getting the job done that you need, but also helping the employee deal with what they need too? And that's a difficult situation.
Callie Zipple:
And sometimes, when there is that "no" you have to be firm and say, "We see this now as a requirement." Sometimes it just has to be laid out and say, "We are identifying this as something that you must do", and having clear expectations and guidelines and open communication about that, I think is key.
Eve:
So if you have to mandate an EAP to get someone what they need, then you need to do that. Dealing with a lot of public service professionals, first responders, they often don't want to show that they're having weakness. They could have PTSD from an incident that they went to, something that they saw. So that's something that we can do. And we often do, do is recommend that you go see a professional. We'll mandate that if we see that it's impacting your work because of a situation or a scene that you came upon. And so we can do that in situations as well. I think it's for the betterment of the employee, even if they may not see it in the time.
Callie Zipple:
I agree. And I think this next question will... It's a great segue from that to this next question. And it's about creating a culture in organizations or an environment that allows for these difficult conversations to happen. And I think sometimes our organizations do this well and other organizations won't allow it to happen. So do you have any tips or suggestions for organizations who are looking to create this environment where open and honest dialogue can happen?
Eve:
I think it starts from the top. So from as far up in the organization as you can get, someone to come out and say that this is going to be a safe place to talk about it. A lot of organizations now have wellness programs, but the wellness programs only deal with physical health. They don't focus on mental health. So to add that as a component into it, I think is a great start. But to have those conversations, you can invite folks in from your local behavioral health center, from the National Alliance on Mental Illness, they have branches in all 50 states. They have local offices, invite them to come in and talk about it. Have that literature available, not just that little EAP brochure that sits in the corner somewhere, but have more frequent conversations about why this is important, why we want everyone to be happy and healthy in the workplace.
So as much communication around that as you can. And if there is something going on in your workplace, such as, unfortunately, if there was a client suicide or in employee suicide, to talk about that, to bring it up so that people know we have resources available. And if you do need help to come forward that they won't be penalized for it. I think that so many times people are afraid of that they're going to be penalized for saying, "I need help." So to create that through open communication and open dialogue, I think is a big step.
Callie Zipple:
I wonder if, and I've never done this in previous organizations and it just came to me as maybe a suggestion, but an EAP orientation. I think, like you said before, a lot of our organizations have an EAP for our employees, but it's something that we mention and then never talk about again, because we hope that it's not something that our employees have to use, but the reality is that it's not just for difficult situations that are happening. And sometimes an EAP program can offer much more than crisis aversion or issue management and things like that. So I wonder if maybe an EAP orientation would help some employers who have that as a benefit so that when, and if an employee needs to use it, they're more comfortable doing that.
Eve:
We do a lot in my current organization to try to talk about the other benefits that EAP offers. So yes, you get your visits to the counselor, but you can also get legal help. You can get help for elder care. We've had onsite training for elder care support because that can be very draining if you're taking care of a parent or somebody else. So I think that's a great idea is to try to orient people to their benefits, because they really don't understand. They think, "Oh, I don't need that", or, "I don't want to call them", or maybe they're afraid that my employee will know that I called, which is not the case. We're not going to know if you reach out to use that benefit, but it's something that's there for employees to use.
Callie Zipple:
Unfortunately, there's a stigma around this EAP. What is the EAP? What does it stand for? Why do our employers not really talk about it all that much? And so I think maybe an orientation would be a great way to avoid that. So again, just came to me as we were going through this discussion. So I appreciate all of the feedback and the conversation that we've had thus far, but wanted to insert another thing that I heard around mental health that I want to get your take on. And I heard a speaker recently who said that each new generation has more mental health issues than the one before and they are more open to talking about them. So if we don't have cultures that allow for the younger generations to have these conversations, we will lose them as employees. And so how can we make sure that our policies and processes are ready for this increased awareness and prevalence of mental health in the workplace?
Eve:
I think that's a great question. Millennials like to show up to work as the whole person. They're less likely than previous generations to hide a piece of them. They want to be able to come in. And part of it is, yes, there are increased diagnoses of depression and anxiety. So individuals today feel more comfortable talking about it even increased suicide rates unfortunately, is occurring, but people feel more comfortable talking about it because almost all of us know somebody who's been impacted by it and we want to talk about it. So I think the most important thing is to make sure that your HR professionals and your managers know what the ADA allows, what the FMLA Act allows, because this is something that qualifies under ADA.
So if you have an individual that you know is going through something that's impairing their work ability, have that interactive conversation. I think that's first and foremost, because they may need time off to adjust the medication. They may need time off for meeting with a provider or they may need time off to help deal with a family member who's going through something. I think that's first and foremost. And put it out in your policy so that if someone does come forward, it's not going to detract from any potential promotions that they may be in track for. It's not going to impact their job whatsoever. It's a shame that you have to come out and say that. But I think sometimes you have to come out and say that for the good of you as the employee.
We want you to come forward and say this so that we can help you, but it's not going to derail any career path that you're on and make sure that your managers and everybody know that, yes, they do need this time to take care of whatever they need to take care of. And when they come back, they're going to be a better employee for you. Silence undermines workplace productivity. It's harming our business cultures. It's costing us billions of dollars every year. So having procedures in place for reporting it and for coming forward and saying, "I need help", is going to improve your workplace productivity a hundred fold.
Callie Zipple:
And I think having policies and procedures in place is crucial to this management of mental health, mainly because it's a very difficult thing to prove. You don't see it, you can't hear it, but there is some mutual need for information sharing while you're going through this issue of mental health. So having a policy and a procedure in place that says, "This is your responsibility in this process, this is my responsibility in this process. And together, we can get through this and get you better on the other side." The other thing I think is important too is, it's around discipline. So we've all worked with managers who make light of these sorts of questions or issues that employees raise to them. And this idea that we don't address that I think can hinder any progress around the mental health issue in a workplace. So any sorts of ideas you have around making sure that if something comes up where somebody makes light of a situation or doesn't take it seriously, what can we do as HR practitioners to mitigate that?
Eve:
Well, I think it comes back to setting that culture that we talked about earlier. Training your managers, training employees about the correct language to use. And then if they're not following, coming forward and saying, "Look, we're going to hold you accountable because you're not using the correct language that you needed to." And unfortunately, you hate to discipline people for stuff like that, but it all goes into the company culture. If someone gets away with saying it one time, they're going to get away with saying it again. And people need to feel comfortable to come forward and say, "This person over here was talking inappropriately", and reporting it.
Bailey:
Ultimately, I think, and this is Bailey, I think that the millennial and Gen Z generations are going to define the future of the workplace in this area. It's responsibility of HR to get on board, because it's entirely conceivable among this generation that they have much more of a respect for holistic and mental health overall. So it's going to be having the tools in place to address when they come to you and say, "Hey, I need X, Y, or Z", because overall, the generation has an intolerance for intolerance.
Callie Zipple:
I think what's most important about this topic too, is that if you're not already talking about it, you're late. And that's because millennials are already coming into the workplace, Gen Z's are actually also already coming into the workplace. So if they have this changing mentality around being forward about the issues that they have, and you don't have policies and processes in place to handle that, you're late to the game, you're late to the party. So organizations who aren't already talking about it need to get on board with it and start figuring out how they mitigate these sorts of conversations.
Eve:
Oh, absolutely. And there's so many different things that organizations can do, from establishing their confidentiality, the requirements and how they're going to stay in touch with employees when they're out on mental health leave. There's so many things that organizations need to be doing to address that just in general education. So that individuals who are going through a depressive stake understand, "Okay, this is what I what's happening to me. And I can reach out and get that assistance", because sometimes it's hard to admit that you're having a problem yourself. You think, "Oh, I'll just snap out of it. I can just feel better. What's wrong with me?" So having that training in the organization, they go, "Okay, this is maybe what I'm going through. And I should try to reach out." I think there's so much that HR professionals can do to make an impact in our employees. And that's what we're there for to help them and help the business.
Callie Zipple:
Well, I appreciate you suggesting this topic. I think it is something like I said before, we should all be already talking about if we're not. So thank you again. Is there anything that you haven't shared so far that you want to share with our listeners?
Eve:
I would just encourage them to get in touch with their local organizations, whether that's NAMI, the National Alliance on Mental Illness, whether that's a local behavioral health center to start building that relationship, to educate not only your senior leaders, but your employees there. And so that they know where those resources are and you can help refer them in the right place. You're already building those relationships so that when something comes up, you know who to reach out to and be a resource to your employees.
Callie Zipple:
I think that's great advice. There are all sorts of associations that have done this work for us, and we need to tap into those resources. So thank you again so much for coming out. If you wouldn't mind, if our listeners would like to connect with you, what is the best way to reach out?
Eve:
Absolutely. I'm on LinkedIn and my email is probably the best because I'm not a good tweeter. I don't keep up so much, but my email is eve.tweeting@hrflorida.org. And I'd be happy to talk about that or talk about stigma-free campaigns or anything else that we can assist with.
Callie Zipple:
Wonderful. Well, thank you again for our listeners. Again, I'm Callie Zipple. I can be found on LinkedIn. I am out on Twitter and Instagram @SHRMCallieZ. Visit us out on our website at shrm.org/honesthr. You can suggest guests and upcoming topics. You can also subscribe to all of our episodes there. Find us on iTunes or anywhere you listen to your other podcast. We're happy you're here and we hope you'll come back for the next episode of Honest HR.